Mickey Z

Cool Observer

Wednesday, February 09, 2005

Some things Ward Churchill didn't say

Posted by Mickey Z on 02/09 at 04:40 PM

Unrelated question: are you/were you Mickey Z the Underground Poet?

Posted by Siannan on from NY 02/09 at 08:59 PM

The one and only...and do I know you?

Posted by Mickey Z. on from 02/09 at 09:12 PM

Uh, I’m just another honky poser living in Navajoland. It’s a sanctuary of sorts for me. Thanks for reminding me of what Ward Churchill didn’t say.

And by the way, you spoke for me quite well this time.

I hope to return the favor some day.

Best Wishes.

Posted by Jim Crittenden on from Navajo Nation 02/09 at 09:32 PM

Huh?

Posted by Mickey Z. on from 02/09 at 09:33 PM

No, but I know you from back in the day. I’ve always wondered about the person who wrote those pithy stickers and put them up and down the Lexington Ave. line. Thanks for making my trek to Hunter College more interesting, and I’ll be adding your syndication feed to my friends list.

Posted by Siannan on from NYC 02/09 at 09:54 PM

You’ve just made my night. Thanks.

I hope you’ll stop by and leave some comments, too.

Posted by Mickey Z. on from 02/09 at 09:58 PM

With pleasure, good sir. Your subterranean scrivenings are fondly remembered.

Posted by Siannan on from NYC 02/09 at 10:03 PM

While I appreciate the political depth and sharpness, the spirit of rebellion I do encounter some difficulties with the kind of “humor” displayed in some of the comments. They seem to illustrate by themselve some degree of misunderstanding.
Anyway, I have mentioned your page in the ezine ZITIG (http://www.zitig.de/transit/zitig_new/index.php) and hope many more readers will enjoy your criticism!
Best wishes,
HLH

Posted by Haimo L. Handl on from Vienna - Austria 02/10 at 07:42 AM

Thanks, Haimo...although I’m not sure what humorous comments you are referring to.

Posted by Mickey Z. on from 02/10 at 08:16 AM

I’ve seen so many quotes of Churchill’s taken out of context by people who wouldn’t know a primary history source if you whopped them upside the head with it. I’ve read a million articles on what he said. Thanks for taking the other side. Once again, if one really wanted to Support the Troops they’d show their flag-draped coffins being unloaded each and every day.

Posted by pk on from neb 02/10 at 02:40 PM

attaguy mick! I’m with the refuseniks.
funny how little we hear about them

see “bad news frm israel” greg philo and mike berry
also “the palestinians, in search of a just peace”
cheryl rubenberg

Posted by christopher on from as far north as you can get and still be in vermon 02/10 at 04:12 PM

That diary quotation--can I get a citation for it? (Just a suggestion: you and a lot of other bloggers are amazingly knowledgeable, and some of us who have not read the primary source material you are drawing upon (e.g., Ben-Gurion’s diaries) would love to spread some of the stuff you dig up around. The problem is, unless I can cite which book or article it came from, the quote is vulnerable to accusations that it is 1. taken out of context or 2. pure fiction. I know you’re not an academic and all that, but there is a rational purpose to footnotes and citations that has nothing to to do with following the rules or making college perfessers happy. It actually helps to build up a knowledge base that is objective--as much as anything can be--because it is based on primary source material that anyone can check.

Now I know how to do a Google search (keywords “Ben-Gurion” and “diaries") and my guess is that in short order I could find out how to get a hold of the diaries. But of course I’d still have to buy a whole book I probably don’t want to read and might not be able to afford to buy anyhow,and slog through a bunch of crap that doesn’t interest me to find what i’m looking for. AndI like the qutation enough that if there was no other way, I might do that.

But the average citizen, and godknows the average reporter, they won’t have my level of motivation. So by not including the citation you diminish the power of your own piece--especially if it’s being read by someone in printed form.

I know I’ve been long winded about this but I really think it’s important. The wingers and the mainstream press are always repeating various kinds of unattributed bullshit. We shouldn’t be doing the same thing.

And again, can I get that particular citation, so I don’t actually have to buty the book and and search for hours for that particular quotation?

Posted by Jeff Bogdan on from Red Bank, NJ, USA 02/10 at 04:16 PM

Jeff: I got the diary quote here: http://www.chomsky.info/articles/199309--.htm

I agree about citations...but it would reach the point of insanity if I had to back up every controversial statement I write (some qould say that all my statements controversial). My writing output would be cut in half. I’ll have to re-consider this and see what I come up with.

Christopher: Thanks. I keep up with Israeli news in many ways but for years, I’ve subscribed to “The Other Israel.”

Posted by Mickey Z. on from 02/10 at 04:36 PM

citations shmitations, who cares! (john bookworm, from his opus LOTSA BOOKS, NO ENUF WORMS.)

real reason for writing: communism was the brainchild of german-jewish intellectuals. two, in fact. i don’t doubt that a cerebral superspecimen like robertson harbors many a dark thought but his statement above is unassailable. (engels’ book on the german workers protests is the best bit of historiography i’ve ever read.) (me, now, here)

Posted by dave on from seattle 02/10 at 05:13 PM

Dave, yes, THAT communism (described in the manifesto) literally was, but the idea, the concept of communism is inherent in any human being, well, at least the dreaming ones. In reality, imho, there is just too little simple sincerity. Whatever.
Mickey I recently read your book Saving Private Power (I just LOVE the title&pic) in italian, it made me sick at moments, I feel so ashamed I fell for all that american crap in my youth… we were all so impressed by that since in “real-socialism” in former Yu we were supposed to be impressed by the eastern countries. However I would like to make sort of a correction to the relations of the start of the war in the territories of today croatia, just please tell me where the discuccion is appropriate. I’ll keep on surfing your site which i discovered only days ago while being an occasional lurker at zmag for years!

Posted by Boris O. on from Croatia /coast, close to Slovenia&Italy 02/14 at 12:25 PM

Hello Boris...glad you found the site. It’s very cool to “meet” someone who read the Italian version of that book. It will be re-released (in English) as a paperback this year. New title (sorry): “There is No Good War.”

As for your comments on the book, I guess it’s best to e-mail me directly:
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Thanks again…

Posted by Mickey Z. on from 02/14 at 01:27 PM

caro boris, si, QUELLO communismo. i had pretty much given up on orthodox marxism but bloody george has made me reconsider. capitalism leads inexorably to bushism.

how do croatians feel about the EU? as a longtime world federalist i’m delighted by what’s happening in europe, africa and s. america, even if we wofeds think they r doing it all wrong.

caro z, i’d like to hear what boris has to say on the topic of the italian version of yr book. y take him off the board?

ciao ragazzi, ci leggiamo

Posted by dave on from sunny seattle 02/14 at 05:43 PM